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Thread: US Elections 2020 - These little earthquakes. Here we go again.

  1. #466
    Find a way to get in the way. MTC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Regina Phalange View Post
    And that's why I hate Bernie now because he knows what is done in his name and he pretends not to know about it or that it matters.
    This. He knows but as long as it benefits him, it's fine. The Bros are putting Candidate over country. Sounds familiar. Where have I heard that before?
    And the ghosts that we knew will flicker from view
    And we'll live a long life

  2. #467
    Loves ponies. Hates phonies. Regina Phalange's Avatar
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    The best thing I can say about Bernie is that I don't think he'd do a 3rd party run if he loses again. So there's that.

    *Side-eyes Tulsi*

  3. #468
    Loves ponies. Hates phonies. Regina Phalange's Avatar
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    I know that even if he loses it's not really over. There is a lot of cleaning up to do and indictments galore. But this thought, imagining that this is Warren or Biden or Bernie or whomever (not tulsi, not marianne) just made me cry.



    A year is a long time. And it's going to be a hard election. But one year seems so short after the last three very, VERY long years.

  4. #469
    Senior Member uncanny hats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MTC View Post
    This. He knows but as long as it benefits him, it's fine. The Bros are putting Candidate over country. Sounds familiar. Where have I heard that before?
    I always find this to never add up, though. I feel like the worst thing we can say is that he's so arrogant that he thinks his message alone is strong enough that he doesn't need to play dirty tricks.

    He's just released a statement defending and apologizing to Biden of all people over something one of his surrogates released. That's unheard of in politics and we could most certainly never expected any of the other campaigns to do such a thing. I don't know...I'm dubious of the idea that Sanders is ready to lead a country but I'm not sure he pretends anything.

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  6. #471
    Loves ponies. Hates phonies. Regina Phalange's Avatar
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    Hillary is right and wrong. Bernie's fucking garbage but she should have either not said anything or pledged to support any non-tulsi/marianne/steyer nominee. She's not wrong, but she sucks all the other air out of the room and she has to know it by now. Just... lie low. It's not fair. It's not right. But it is how it is. She's not going to make anyone say "Well, if Hillary says Bernie sucks, let me vote Klobuchar." And while Bernie is garbage, it is nice FOR ONCE he apologized for something his fucking garbage people did.

    This article was really good and set me in a bad mood against Bernie when I read it this morning

    Trump's MAGA supporters and Twitter Bernie Bros have this ugly tactic in common
    Bernie Twitter operates under the self-righteous guise of being the true progressives of the internet. But their harassing tactics are anything but progressive


    Bernie Twitter operates under the self-righteous guise of being the true progressives of the internet. This smugness distinguishes their tweets. But there’s nothing progressive about attacking members of your own party who may have reservations about the presidential candidate you’re supporting. There’s also nothing progressive about having so little tolerance for different opinions that even the hint of opposition is enough to incite a virtual mob

    ...

    Certainly, Sanders hasn’t encouraged the ugliness that his supporters display and I am confident they do not reflect his politics or the kind of discourse he wants as the would-be standard bearer for the Democratic Party. Giving him that benefit of the doubt, he needs to vehemently denounce the tactics being deployed on his behalf, in his name, in real time. Calling for civility and respectful dialogue requires more than the occasional comment, it will take vigilant admonition.

    Look, I’m not pretending that Twitter isn’t a dumpster fire. But I will say that as a person of color, I have never been attacked in such a heinous way by the supporters of former Vice President Joe Biden, Sen. Amy Klobuchar or former South Bend, Indiana, Mayor Pete Buttigieg. Candidates must set a standard of conduct for their supporters, and if it’s not met, it must be denounced. Trump is unwilling to do this, but Democrats shouldn’t sink to the same subbasement.

  7. #472
    Senior Member uncanny hats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Regina Phalange View Post
    Hillary is right and wrong. Bernie's fucking garbage but she should have either not said anything or pledged to support any non-tulsi/marianne/steyer nominee. She's not wrong, but she sucks all the other air out of the room and she has to know it by now. Just... lie low. It's not fair. It's not right. But it is how it is. She's not going to make anyone say "Well, if Hillary says Bernie sucks, let me vote Klobuchar." And while Bernie is garbage, it is nice FOR ONCE he apologized for something his fucking garbage people did.

    This article was really good and set me in a bad mood against Bernie when I read it this morning

    Trump's MAGA supporters and Twitter Bernie Bros have this ugly tactic in common
    Bernie Twitter operates under the self-righteous guise of being the true progressives of the internet. But their harassing tactics are anything but progressive
    I understand your anger but the irony here is that you're mad at Bernie Bros and Hillary just pulled a classic Trump schoolyard bullying "Nobody likes you" move on Bernie. And also, no one a with conscience is going to vote for Klobuchar as she's a known abuser.

    Also, whether anyone likes it or not, Bernie Bros aren't real. And calling them bros has particular gendered weirdness given who his base is.
    The research reveals that, contrary to popular belief, Bernie Sanders supporters are more female and less white than any of the leading 2020 Democratic presidential candidates.
    I genuinely don't know what's going to happen if Bernie wins the nomination. A very small minority of democrats hate him and I suspect they're willing to wreck the entire country if it means spitting on him. What's most likely true, though, is that even if he loses, he's likely to help out whoever wins the nom, just like he did with Hillary.

  8. #473
    Loves ponies. Hates phonies. Regina Phalange's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uncanny hats View Post
    I understand your anger but the irony here is that you're mad at Bernie Bros and Hillary just pulled a classic Trump schoolyard bullying "Nobody likes you" move on Bernie. And also, no one a with conscience is going to vote for Klobuchar as she's a known abuser.

    Also, whether anyone likes it or not, Bernie Bros aren't real. And calling them bros has particular gendered weirdness given who his base is.

    I genuinely don't know what's going to happen if Bernie wins the nomination. A very small minority of democrats hate him and I suspect they're willing to wreck the entire country if it means spitting on him. What's most likely true, though, is that even if he loses, he's likely to help out whoever wins the nom, just like he did with Hillary.
    Hillary was stupid as fuck to go after Bernie, but she's 100% right to be angry at him after the booing and sulking he and the BERNIE BROS did. His women fans are icky, but it's the men specifically who go full gross and scary behavior. Refusing to admit it and acknowledge it out of some ideological purity over someone who say... won't vote for sanctions against Russia... is bullshit. He is not responsible for his BROS, but after all this time refusing to tamp it down to cultivate his own cult of personality is very telling. He loves the adulation and he's in it for himself, not the good of all of us.

    And I will vote for him before dawn breaks on election day if I have to.

    The people who will burn this thing down are his supporters. It's ludicrous to suggest any other legitimate candidate's supporters would do that en masse. His "help" for Hillary was begrudging and LATE. He STAYED IN THE RACE long after he was mathematically out of it. When people STILL TODAY whine about how she "stole" the primary through "superdelegates" or some kind of witch's circle on the third full moon, HE DOES NOT CORRECT THEM.

    He may win and do a fantastic job. Great. But he's being a giant wiener and his followers are the fucking worst and he allows it, which is all I need to know about him. Identity politics are bullshit unless your identity is a bernie supporter, I guess.

  9. #474
    Senior Member Nick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uncanny hats View Post
    even if he loses, he's likely to help out whoever wins the nom, just like he did with Hillary.
    Wait. In what bizarro world did that happen? The most tepid, sulky endorsement ever, virtual invisibility post-primary, and zero attempt to rein in his bitter supporters who were talking shit right up until the election? (In fact he hired 2016 shit-talking shill extraordinaire Nina Turner as national co-chair for 2020).

  10. #475
    Senior Member uncanny hats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    Wait. In what bizarro world did that happen? The most tepid, sulky endorsement ever, virtual invisibility post-primary, and zero attempt to rein in his bitter supporters who were talking shit right up until the election? (In fact he hired 2016 shit-talking shill extraordinaire Nina Turner as national co-chair for 2020).
    Did Hillary reign in her supporters or no? Because all this talking shit is fine, but really it's just talking shit. And for the record,



    Which is literally not something the other campaigns would ever do.

    As for tepid:

    The New Yorker on Bernie fighting for Hillary

    As Sanders finished his speech in Raleigh—“We have to do everything that we can to elect Secretary Clinton!”—Clinton and Pharrell were on their feet, cheering. “Wow!” Clinton said, when she took to the rostrum. “Whew! I gotta say, after hearing from these two extraordinary men, I feel all fired up and ready to go for the next five days!” She knew what it was like to run against Sanders. Having him on her side was “a lot more fun.” A few hours later, Sanders was off on his own to Iowa. Trump is ahead in that state, in the latest average of polls, by about two and a half points. Sanders had three events scheduled for Friday—Cedar Falls, Iowa City, Davenport. On Saturday, there would be more.
    And Rachel Maddow



    Sounds like the opposite of tepid and sulky. Yeah, I just checked the antonyms for tepid and sulky, so that's not really true.

    Bernie's a lot of things, but I'm not sure why anyone would characterize the way you did.

  11. #476
    Let them eat cheese flan Nancy's Avatar
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    Bernie still doesn't seem to get it, in my humble opinion. I'm really going to have to hold my nose if he's the nom.

    The bias against female presidential candidates is real. A philosopher explains what women are up against.

    By Sean Illing@seanillingsean.illing@vox.com Jan 17, 2020, 11:30am EST


    https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit..._jQJfhUJUQ2WCI

    Quote Originally Posted by Kate Manne
    "I think a lot of it has to do with the spirit in which these questions are raised. One reason people are suspicious of Sanders is that telling a female potential presidential candidate about these biases, at that stage, doesn’t seem diplomatic or helpful. But I do think there’s a way of acknowledging these biases that actually increases the chance of combating them successfully by saying, “Look, a woman would be really up against it in certain ways and we’re going to have to be vigilant in fighting for her if we believe she’s the best candidate.”

    That’s what I’ve tried to say with respect to Elizabeth Warren. I think we have to be very careful about certain stories getting unwarranted traction or of double standards being applied. And maybe even more importantly, we have to be careful not to celebrate her on the wrong grounds. The research about hyper-communal women with power being acceptable worries me because it feeds into gender biases about how women are supposed to be — perfectly empathetic, perfectly compassionate, perfectly safe.

    So we have to acknowledge that the biases really make this tough for women, but not impossible, and that there may be female candidates who are really worth fighting for, and then we have to go out and do that work. I don’t think it works to just live in denial about the biases."

  12. #477
    Senior Member uncanny hats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Regina Phalange View Post
    The best thing I can say about Bernie is that I don't think he'd do a 3rd party run if he loses again. So there's that.

    *Side-eyes Tulsi*
    She's suing Hillary for defamation

  13. #478
    She has a plan for that. Steve SFM's Avatar
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    True.

    And fuck that shit.
    And it's going to be how do we think government should work and who do we think government should work for?

  14. #479
    megaphone to my chest MikeEP's Avatar
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    I'm curious if she really has a case considering Hillary didn't refer to her by name or say anything that identified her. I thought it was funny that Tulsi volunteered herself as the alleged "Russian plant" at the time those comments came out.

  15. #480
    strike every chord that you feel Owen's Avatar
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    Oh yeah, Tulsi is a total piece of garbage and this isn't going to play out well. She's playing for the Fox News viewers though, and to spoil the election.

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