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Thread: Catholicism WOW thread.

  1. #16
    she said destroy Lágnætti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by other pete View Post
    ... with my ex still having to get in to the boot of their car
    WHAT the hell.

  2. #17
    condemned to wires and hammers ebby's Avatar
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    Helen, the link I was trying to post yesterday was an article about a new Vatican announcement which threatens a more severe penalty or anyone involved in even attempting to ordain a female priest, than the penalties they have for priests convicted of child abuse.

    Women priests: worse than child abuse.

    I'll find the Irish Times piece again shortly but I can't post links from this mobile version of the forum it seems.

  3. #18
    she said destroy Lágnætti's Avatar
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    Well, I'd expect an ancient, all-male, pedophiles' club to look more leniently on fucking small kids than letting women in. It's only natural really.

  4. #19
    it wouldn't even matter other pete's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gog View Post
    WHAT the hell.
    I know! And this was late 1990s not 1950s. They had/have this rationalisation that God must approve of their patience & suffering because he's in to all that, so actually he loves them even more because of the guilt that he has chosen to let them carry. OR SOMETHING. I don't know many religious people but that struck me as seeming a particularly Catholic-flavoured way of internalising it - am I noticing the obvious or stereotyping?

  5. #20
    Curious Hedgehog Tarendai's Avatar
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    Did anybody see what Dot said in eastenders when that girl asked her about the Anglican church?
    GSV Tarendai

  6. #21
    condemned to wires and hammers ebby's Avatar
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    One point in Benedict's favour: acting against this man:

    Pope acts against incest priest's group
    Immensely wealthy Catholic organisation, set up by controversial Mexican cleric and favoured by John Paul II, likely to be closed down


    The Legionaries of Christ, the Roman Catholic group that combines an estimated 21bn fortune with intense moral turpitude and extreme conservatism, is facing its nemesis this month. For years the organisation was protected by John Paul II, the Polish pope, and his former secretary Cardinal Stanislaw Dziwisz, Archbishop of Krakow. Now the reputation of Father Marcial Maciel, a Mexican who founded the group in 1941 when he was studying for holy orders, is at last falling victim to the reforming drive of John Paul II's German successor, Benedict XVI.

    Incestuous father of three or perhaps six children, serial paedophile, morphine addict, lover of la dolce vita, and pretend CIA agent, Maciel, who died in 2008, aged 87, built up a huge religious empire. It commanded the allegiance of 750 priests and 2,500 seminarians from 39 countries in the Legion proper, with 70,000 members in a lay offshoot, Regnum Christi, the Kingdom of Christ, and 131,000 students in its schools and universities.

    [...]

    Benedict often expressed his distaste for Maciel, whose early predilection for paedophilia was detected but not acted upon by Rome.

    [...]

    Referring to the Legion's practice of imposing on its members a "fourth vow" in addition to the three traditional ones of poverty, chastity and obedience which demanded unconditional and uncomplaining acceptance of what Maciel said, the Vatican said: "By pushing away and casting doubt upon all those who questioned his behaviour... he created around him a defence mechanism that made him unassailable for a long period, making it difficult to know his true life."

    [...]

    The late pope had called Maciel "an efficacious guide to youth", and applauded his gift for attracting young men to the depleted ranks of the priesthood. Senior figures in the church, who were often the recipients of the Legion's financial largesse, rejoiced in his genius for fundraising and fortune building.

    [...]

    After surviving constant accusations of sex with young men, Maciel took up with women late in life. Raul Gonzalez and his younger brother Cristian were born to Maciel and Blanca Lara, a domestic servant, whom Maciel met in 1976 when she was 19 and he 56. He told her his name was Raul Rivas and that he was a CIA agent and a security man for oil companies. The two boys and Omar a son she had had from a previous relationship and whom he adopted were brought up in a house he bought for her in Cuernavaca. In a recent television interview, Raul claimed: "When I was seven years old, I was lying down with him like any boy, any son with his father. He pulled down my pants and tried to rape me." He was later sent to a boarding school in Ireland.

    Maciel had at least one other liaison. A few years after meeting Blanca, he met Norma Hilda Baos in Acapulco. In 1987, when she was 26, she bore his daughter, also named Norma Hilda. At times their father took his children on trips to Europe. His son Raul is now suing the Legionaries of Christ in the US for their part in allowing Maciel to maintain an incestuous relationship with him for many years.

    The full article is here.

  7. #22
    she said destroy Lágnætti's Avatar
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    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-11061296

    The police, the Catholic Church and the state conspired to cover up a priest's suspected role in one of the worst atrocities of the Northern Ireland Troubles, an investigation has found.

    Nine people died in bombings in Claudy, County Londonderry on 31 July 1972.

    The NI Police Ombudsman's probe found that high-level talks led to Fr James Chesney, a suspect in the attack, being moved to the Irish Republic.

    Download the reader here No action was ever taken against Fr Chesney, who died in 1980.

    Northern Ireland Secretary Owen Paterson said that the government was "profoundly sorry" that Fr Chesney had not been properly investigated.

    In 2002, the Ombudsman, Al Hutchinson, began a probe into the original investigation.

    His report, published on Tuesday, found that detectives in 1972 had concluded that Fr Chesney was an IRA leader and had been involved in the bombing.

    He added that by acquiescing to a deal between the government and the Catholic Church to move Fr Chesney to a parish in the Irish republic, the Royal Ulster Constabulary was guilty of a "collusive act".
    Child abuse, terrorism ... is there anything the Catholic Church won't stoop to covering up?

  8. #23
    Senior Member JAE's Avatar
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    Did you see Cardinal Sen Brady refusing to condemn anything on BBC News earlier?

  9. #24
    condemned to wires and hammers ebby's Avatar
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    Heard him on the news driving home saying that it's the police's fault for not investigating further, which would have either implicated the priest or cleared his name. Nice way of passing the blame there - I'm sure the police not investigating further had absolutely nothing to do with the Church's influence at all.

  10. #25
    she said destroy Lágnætti's Avatar
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    Yeah, the article says about the British government wanting to shift him away quietly because they thought arresting a priest would cause such ructions in the community they'd regret it. It shows the deeply ingrained the Church was in the power structure of the country at the time.

  11. #26
    she said destroy Lágnætti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JAE View Post
    Did you see Cardinal Sen Brady refusing to condemn anything on BBC News earlier?
    I didn't. We have Murdoch Channel on at work, unfortunately. Anyway, it's nice to know where the pro-life church stands on priests blowing shit up, isn't it?

  12. #27
    Curious Hedgehog Tarendai's Avatar
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    It annoys me greatly that the religious establishment is getting little or no flak. If it was a lone janitor in a school that was responsible, he'd have been burnt at the stake by a raving mob of scousers by now. Instead we get "leave religion alone"

    JAE, Im in love with your avatar!
    GSV Tarendai

  13. #28
    It is I, you son of a bitch. blissgurl's Avatar
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    Huh, and they say there are no such thing as Christian terrorists. Guess that destroys that idea.

  14. #29
    Senior Member JAE's Avatar
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    Bishop Daly's 'doubts' over Claudy bomb report claims

    The former Bishop of Derry, Edward Daly, has doubts about allegations of Father James Chesney's involvement in the IRA.

    A NI Police Ombudsman report confirmed that detectives in 1972 believed Fr Chesney was its South Derry brigade's director of operations and was involved in the planning of that year's Claudy bombings which killed nine people.

    Bishop Daly said he had difficulty accepting the police ombudsman's conclusions.

    He said he interviewed the priest about allegations that he was an active member in the IRA in the 1970s and was told that he was only a "verbal republican".

    "As I have stated many times before, I have always had serious doubts about the long-standing allegations surrounding Father James Chesney relating to the Claudy bombing," he said.

    "He died 30 years ago and I am prepared now to leave him to the Lord, the God of justice.

    "I have to admit being sceptical of much of the RUC and Special Branch intelligence in the early 1970s and the interrogation techniques and other devious methods by which some such intelligence was acquired.

    "Father Chesney vehemently denied involvement in any kind of IRA activity to me on two occasions, in 1974, not long after I was appointed Bishop of Derry, and again in 1977. He also denied such involvement earlier to my predecessor, Bishop Neil Farren."

    Three no-warning bombs exploded in the small County Londonderry village on 31 July 1972.

    The Police Ombudsman, Al Hutchinson, found talks between the Catholic Church, the police and the government led to Fr Chesney, who was suspected of involvement in the attack, being moved to the Irish Republic. No action was ever taken against Fr Chesney, who died in 1980.
    'Betrayal'

    Mr Hutchinson said some detectives' attempts to pursue Fr Chesney were frustrated ahead of a meeting between Northern Ireland Secretary William Whitelaw and the leader of Ireland's Catholics, Cardinal Conway.

    There, it was agreed that the priest would be moved to a parish in Donegal, just over the border in the Irish Republic.

    Bishop Daly said the failure of the RUC to arrest and question Fr Chesney was "beyond understanding".

    "I believe that this constituted a huge betrayal of the victims," he added.

    He said he was not aware of Cardinal Conway's involvement in the case until it was made known by Sam Kinkaid, then Assistant Chief Constable of the PSNI on 20 December 2002.

    "This report now clarifies that the Cardinal's involvement was initiated by the Secretary of State, at the behest of the police," Bishop Daly said.

    "Cardinal Conway did not at any time discuss Father Chesney with me, nor did any police officer or any member of the Northern Ireland Office.

    "During my 20 years as Bishop of Derry, I regularly met such people."

    Bishop Daly said that he had a lengthy meeting with the former Police Ombudsman, Nuala O'Loan, in November 2006 during which he told her her "everything I knew about the case".

    No paramilitary group has ever claimed responsibility for the Claudy bombings, and no-one has been convicted of them.

    Edward Daly was Bishop of Derry between 1974 and 1993.

  15. #30
    condemned to wires and hammers ebby's Avatar
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    I have doubts too.

    About the truthiness of his statement.

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